By Raissa Robles
Nothing is sure about any of the reports coming from the standoff in Sabah, but if they’re true, then people have already been killed as the Sultan’s armed band continues to defy both Malaysian and Philippine governments.
Along with many others — Filipinos, Malaysians and Sabahans — I believe the issue calls for sobriety.
I have just read a website, coconutsmanila.com, which says that two Philippine websites were recently defaced by hackers, apparently because of the Sabah issue.
Before we jump to conclusions that Malaysians are involved, let’s remember that there are other interest groups riding on the conflict for their own political purposes. It suits them to escalate the issue and cause instability in the south and trouble for the government.
My hubby Alan and I were talking about Sabah at breakfast time. He has written a lot more on Sabah than I have.
We were both wondering about two things:
FIRST, why is there such a large constituency in the Philippines for asserting Philippine sovereignty over Sabah? One Facebook group alone has over 10,000 “LIKES”. Supporters are Muslims and Christians alike.
SECOND, why has no Philippine President ever succeeded in dropping the Sabah claim?
Perhaps trying to meaningfully answer these questions will point to a way to resolve this issue that has been a huge thorn in relations between the Philippines and Malaysia.
I have more articles to write on Sabah. But first I need to write my Third Part on the Intellectual Property Code amendments. One amendment, in particular, SUCKS.
Here’s the link to coconutmanila.com
Mel says
raissa says
Sabah was nEVER under the British.
It was rented by a BRITISH COMPANY which obtained a royal charter from the Queen.
TWO VERY DIFFERENT THINGS!
Parekoy says
Conrad is directing his philippics at the wrong person. At first the quest to reclaim Sabah by the Sultan of Sulu seems quixotic, but with thse lives lost, the reopening of ghe issues gave an opening to the Filipino side to be reexamined and exposed Malaysia’s weak argument and they are only propping up their landhrabbing by the non-discussions of the issues since the 60’s.
A blogger’s worth is measured if he or she will set aside his/her blind loyalty to the personality, in this case the president, otherwise one will marginalized his/her credibility. Conrad keeps on defending PNoy’s obsequious remarks on the Sabah issue that Filipinos are starting to question PNoy’s common sense as a leader. He seems nit sophisticated enough to appear that he supports the Sultan’s claim yet also respects Makplaysia as a parter in the Mindanao’s peace process.
Plenty of bloggers are caught in the trap of even brushing off our claims and even sided with Malaysia’s propaanda machine that Sabah is not a rented place.
There will be no peace in Mindanao if we as a Nation don’t pursue ghe claims of the Sultan of Sulu to Sabah. This is a golden opportunity fir al, the factions from MNLF, MNLF, and the government to realize that Malaysia was the main funder and provider of logistics and traing to the Rebels and they were used to keep our government busy fighting among ourselves and we did not have time to see that Malaysia was the one pulling the string in what was happe ing in Mindanao.
If these fighting factions realized the real culprit, then the prize is more than enough for al, the factions to share for their progress, pitixally and economically.
You have to know that the Malaysians are thevasters of Wayang Kulit-shadow puppet show!
Alan says
You’re certainly correct in saying that this bloody mess has called everybody’s attention to the problem — but in the worst possible way. I doubt if Malaysia will be so eager to come to terms favorable to the Sultan or to the Philippines for a long while.
I heard that there are nine main factions, 32 different personalities, all receiving part of the cession fee, many claiming to the title of Sultan and to Sabah. So, which one are we supposed to support and/or cheer on?
It’s true that the Malaysians have supported unrest in Mindanao for decades, and I really doubt this mess will make them think of stopping. What is your prescription for dealing with this? No president — not even the dictator Marcos — no army, no force has been able to keep the peace in Mindanao. You suggestion is to invade Sabah?
If the Malaysians are masters of wayang kulit (though I think that’s indonesian), Filipinos are feared in SE Asia a masters of legalism, which is why I suppose they’re afraid to face us in court.
Already you’re seeing the fruits of the Sultan’s adventure — Filipino refugees fleeing (back) to Mindanao. How do you propose to deal with this?
Parekoy says
First we must recognize that when PNoy ignored the Sultan’s letter, which they conveniently justified that it was lost and now they found, weighed in the decision for the “incursion” aka suicide mission to Sabah and brought to attention in thevworst possible way. So don’t put the entire blame to the Sultan.
Recognized that the Sultan is a desperate man and we know how desperate men behave. Misuari saw the opportunity and a cunning man will always takevadvantage of that. nur learned from his Wayang Kulit masters, and now the intern becomes the teacher.
If you think deeper, there is a possibility that the differentbfactions in Mindanao band together to face a common enemy-Malaysia, so a possibility that is powerful and symbolic to the fractious Mindanao. Don’t invade Sabah, supoirt the Freedom Fighters continued inflictions of damages to KL, not Sabah. See my comments on another topic-Jamalul Kiram.
In patalkel, the PNoys govt should pursue the help of the UN- He could show that once and for all he supports the constitution and not to fal, in the trap of doung nothing and seen as obsequious to Malaysia, and gain back the suppirt of the Filipinos who were dismayed of his attitude towards this issue by siding with Malaysia and nit as protectors of Filipino interests as well as the accused intruders.
Filipino refugees are on of the costs of this pursuit. We should be aware that even before this incident, Nalaysua deports plenty of illegal Filipinos, so what is new is the increae in numbers and the atrocities and treatment these refugees suffered from the brutal Makaysian authorities. This will be Malaysia’s version of pogrom and we know what happenedvto the Nazis and genocide criminals if ever Malaysia does the unthinkable. These same refugees will be a willing recruit of the cause to reclaim Sabah, with the knowledge they acquired and knowing the tongue and culture, these new breed of Freedom Fighters will add to the headache or say migraine to Malaysias govt. So there is still a benefit to being expelked by Malaysja,it is to the Sultan’s gain as well as Nur’s. Usually their misery will be directed to the Malaysian authorites instead ofvtowards the Sultan. They both lost something and need to take back or need a payback.
Conrad thinks that he is a cynosure when it comes to dispensing opinion, but a consistent of defending PNoy diminish his previous stature for he appears like a paid hack.
At least Joe is not paid so I put joe a tad higher than Conrad. Joe’s unbending support to PNoy is painful spectacle for he must muster acrobatic mental dexterity to achieve convincing his readers tht his bias and presvription to our ills is the best available in the blogosphere.
Myrna says
Well-good luck. The Pnoy bully is finally meeting his match in Malaysia.malaysia knows the Phil government is useless and incompetent thus they can do what they want with the Filipinos in Sabah.nothing will stop them from killing our Filipino brothers. Valte can say all she want about unacceptable abuse – it will go on.so sad that the govt can’t protect it’s citizens. Hopefully prayers will help ….
Victin Luz says
@Myrna and @Parekoy… read our Constitution… We RENOUNCES WAR that is our Nation’s Policy… .. Ibang usapan na pag ang Malaysian ay lumusub na sa territory ng Pilipinas.. Hintay kayo… Kasalanan ni KIRAM, MISUARI at mga COPA ….kaya ganyan ang nangyari…sila dapat ang ikulung at magdusa ngayon.
Alan says
I happen to think that, for someone who’s dancing on the edge of a precipice, Aquino has done a pretty good job. First, he’s managed to prevent Mindanao from going up in flames. Second, he hasn’t renounced the claim to Sabah. That’s a tough tinikling.
It could still get a lot worse – refugees are already starting to arrive in Mindanao.
Joe America says
Perhaps you need to read this article, entitled “Is President Aquino an Idiot?” also in my roster of commentary:
thesocietyofhonor(dot)blogspot(dot)com/2012/10/is-president-aquino-idiot(dot)html
There is a difference between issue and the President. The President is an earnest, decent, capable man working in a complex job that touches us all. If we go about believing that he must make every decision EXACTLY as we would, or he is a bad president, that makes us unbelievabley arrogant. All we do is sit at a typewriter.
He overseas some 20 departments with crucial decisions flying every which way. The notion that he must get them all correct means Filipinos will never be able to give of themselves in sufficent generosity to build a genuine community, a genuine, pluralistic nation. Because a nation has many different ideas and solutions, plus a few healthy mistakes, generally discovered in hindsight.
Malaysia is behind the Philippines on the progression of modern democrateic values. Malaysia is an authoritarian state of the kind you might have under Enrile or Sotto or (gag) Binay. It sets democratic principles, and human rights, aside to exert power and control. Be thankful you live in the Philippines. Be thankful you have the President you have.
Like, be a bit of patriot, eh? Extend yourself.
Parekoy says
Joe,
Maybe it is a challenge for you to criticize PNoy. When you project yourself as a know-it-all blogger, why not show us how to criticize PNoy, or maybe a part of your brain is only capable of extolling his greatness?
Be intellectually honest for a change. You seems not different with the Anti-PNoys after all, you have to defend PNoy no matter what and them to destroy PNoy.
Only then, I might consider you as a legit blogger!
Parekoy
Joe America says
It’s not hard at all to criticize decisions or acts that I deem a mistake. I regularly rag on his failure to support FOI, as I did in his support of the libel provision of the Cybercrime law. But, indeed, I find it difficult to criticize a man because he has a personality different than you or Jesus, if he is earnest, honest, and smart. I respect the Office of the President and give the man in it every benefit of the doubt.
But here’s an idea. Since I am such a lousy blogger, why don’t you take up the cudgel and start writing a proper blog yourself. Show me how it’s done. How easy it is to get it right for all your various readers.
Parekoy says
One example how it is done legit is by appreciating this blog. For me, not my cup of tea owning a blog right now, but perhaps in the future. I did not say you write a lousy blog, I think it is decent but not yet legit. Your cadre will not tell you this, some are too dependent on your morsels that they begin acting like your pets, waiting for their master to feed them.
Thankful for Aquino? Give me a break.
I don’t go with personalities, they come and go. Look at the accomplishments, praise the admin when credit is due, criticize if offtrack. This way we are not coffled to the person.
Avoid the trap of being labeled as pro or con, Faux and NBC adopted that model and CNN still reign. Unsolicited advice: Variety of position. Praise hard hit hard, then Perhaps I might join your Society and many more will come. You don’t even have to poach…
Joe America says
Ahahaha, okay, “my pets”! I’m afraid you have just insulted a lot of very bright, independent, free-thinking Filipinos, most of whom also contribute here at Raissa’s blog. You don’t need to join my society. You clearly don’t read it and you don’t “get it”.
Vibora says
@parekoy,
“some are too dependent on your morsels that they begin acting like your pets, waiting for their master to feed them”
Prrrrrt. Referee= Foul… he he he.
Parekoy, off target and out of focus na. Can’t we stay on the merits and demerits of the subject/argument?
Vibora says
It’s very hard to support the Sultanate of Sulu claim without knowing who the “REAL” Sultan is. Another claimant says this;
“KOTA KINABALU: Mohd Akjan Ali Muhammad, the businessman who controversially proclaimed himself as “Sultan of Sulu” two years ago, has resurfaced and this time he is urging Filipino Sabahans especially Suluks to pledge their loyalty to Malaysia.”
Link on this to follow.
Vibora says
Another Sultan? What a mess…
http://www.freemalaysiatoday.com/category/nation/2013/03/11/be-loyal-to-msia-sabah-suluks-told/
bfdtranscriber says
I am not a pro-PNoy or anything. In fact, I didn’t vote for him. But it takes guts to do what he has done, he has the big picture, remember?
Now, let us consider what others are proposing by giving aid to Kiram’s followers and taking over Sabah militarily.
No, that’s not going to happen… Why? Because you don’t have the military hardware and technology to battle the Malaysian’s mighty armada. You might have the men, but with what weapons do you have?
My God, people, open your eyes… in going to war, you have to calculate what you have with what the others have, or you do a blitzkrieg, which I think we are not capable of doing right now, not with a pitiful military resources we have.
In short, we have to shape up militarily first. ALL OF US.
Look at history, it is littered with Filipinos who died because of military’s unpreparedness against its well armed, well trained enemies.
Look at China, when did it flex its muscles? When it had a military that can confront even the US. What is it doing now? It’s doing what Japan is doing in WW 2, taking what it can take, but just in a different viewpoint.
Filipinos first have to unite, make our country economically viable, the military component fully equipped, its citizens like the Israelis who train their citizens for battle so that when the time comes, they are combat ready.
Then make the Kirams settle their differences, come up with one leader that is supported by ALL THE CLAIMANTS, not just a few. Go to the world body that handles border disputes.
But you know what? This is all pipe dream. As long as Mindanao don’t get their act together, as long as our politicians is bickering, as long as politicians or public servants dip their hands into the public coffer as if it’s their own, as long as there is political dynasties that is pitted against each other, AS LONG AS FILIPINOS are pitted against FELLOW FILIPINOs by other external influences (other countries), nothing will come out of it.
Philippine history will bear me out, it is littered with treachery, corruption, betrayal. Why? Because of what you think it is….
Victin Luz says
WELL EXPLAINED……… NO MORE NO LESS….. Let us RIDE with you…@transcriber…
Mel says
Mel says
INSIGHT | The Sabah claim: A tragedy rooted in ignoring history By: Joel C. Paredes, Special to InterAksyon.com
March 8, 2013 12:47 AM
EXCERPTS
READ THE WHOLE ARTICLE AT
INSIGHT | The Sabah claim: A tragedy rooted in ignoring history – By: Joel C. Paredes, Special to InterAksyon.com
March 8, 2013 12:47 AM
letlet says
Before, Malaysia is the GODFATHER OF MNLF that provided funding to its needs in many ways. Now with the peace negotiations between the government and the MILF being brokered by Malaysia, it is not surprising the MNLF is the leading supporters of the Sultan as the two of them ( MNLF and the Sultan) felt marginalized by this peace negotiations. i think the prime instigator is the MNLF as signified by thousands of them crossing the border of Sabah as fuelled by political opposition.
Why and how did Malaysia become the broker between the govenrment and MILF? In the first instance, Malaysia has a massive vested interest in doing so, primarily the Sabah, wherein it did everything in its power to court everyone/ organization/ group to make bloody sure that Sabah is for its keep whatever the cost is. The Philippine government ,WITH NO INKLING ?, has been MANIPULATED by Malaysian government that played its political card game so ingeniously that at the end found itself in a very boiling water.
When the Sultan put the law into its hand, there is no one to blame except themselves that things did not turn out the way they envision it. He made mistake when he invaded Sabah,
( in international scene that is invasion), then he made another mistake by staying put in Sabah and rejecting PNOY request to go back first to Philippine to talk and deal with the issue diplomatically. He also rejected the boarding of the ship sent by PNOY. PNOY did his best to appease the Sultan. IF THE SULTAN RETURNED TO THE PHILIPPINES AS PNOY REQUESTED, THINGS WOULD HAVE TURNED THE OTHER WAY, NO KILLINGS and much more to the way the Sultan wants it to be.
We Filipinos do not want Philippines to be dragged into a war with Malaysia. We have so much into our plates already. Let the Sultan take the consequences of their actions.
moonie says
he can’t even take the consequences of paying his own medical expenses, gobyerno natin ang sumasagot sa pambayad ng dialysis niya.
letlet says
The Sultan doesn’t have an iota of gratitude to the Filipino people and the government for prolonging his life, let him repay all the medical expenses that he incurs for his dialysis so that he would realize we are his lifesaver.
moonie says
he takes but does not give.
jorge bernas says
@ letlet,
Tama ka letlet, Gusto nang mga KIRAM ay SILA ang dapat sundin dahil akala nila sa hinihingan nila nang TULONG ay mga ALIPIN NILA na susunod na lamang…Ang Presidente na nang PILIPINAS ang nakikiusap na UMUWI na muna saka na pag-usapan ang Problema at nang Makagawa nang SOLUTION pero hindi nakinig kaya ganyan nangyari. Humihingi nang tulong pero hindi naman nakikinig puwede ba naman yon??? Dapat magbigayan para sa KAPAYAPAAN…
Mali kasi ang ginawang paglusob sa SABAH lalo na at ARMADO at handang Mamatay daw? INVATION ang tawag doon at bawal sa international law at saka nakakahiya kong daanin sa Dahas, Tapang at ARMAS ang Kagustuhan???
duquemarino says
Statement: The Presidential Spokesperson on the malicious representations by Jacel Kiram, March 6, 2013
“Ms. Jacel Kiram’s use of a photograph which she claimed were of Malaysian casualties has led to the discovery by media that the photograph was not of Malaysian casualties in the Sabah standoff but of Thai military casualties in a 2007 incident that had nothing to do whatsoever with the standoff in Sabah.”
Read the full statement: http://www.gov.ph/2013/03/06/statement-the-presidential-spokesperson-on-the-malicious-representations-of-jacel-kiram-march-6-2013/
jorge bernas says
@ Moonie,
Abah, Totoo ba moonie na tayo pa nagbabayad nang dialysis ni KIRAM sa taguig at baka kasama na ang ibang mga gamot at hospital bills?
So, that means may gumastos sa mga nagstandoff na mga KIRAM followers sa SABAH, Malaysia para magkaGULO?
Saka bakit hindi sila nakinig kay Pnoy calls na UMUWI muna at nang mapag-usapan ang problema at makapagbalangkas nang magandang SOLUTION…
moonie says
it was in abs-cbnnews.com, the prez made a statement. how could sultan kiram fund the immediate armed incursion into sabah daw, when his fund is low? two big boats ferried the royal army over there. lot of expenses that one. also mentioned in the news was the sultan’s dialysis na sagot daw ng gobyerno.
it’s likely that people with money and vested interests are behind the sultan’s move. rumors in the south is that people are being paid $600 to join the sultan’s troops. that’s lot of incentive for poor people who will only be cannon fodder. maybe they’ll only be foot soldiers carrying arms, food and ammunitions for the sultan’s army. rumor is unconfirmed though.
ismail bin buang says
RM5300 is only cession monies. It not a rent. USA is still paying cession monies to Russia for Alaska. Kiram is just a pawn, he knew it. The real question is “Who is bank-rolling him?. kiram’s cause is an anomaly, while the MILF and MNLF are fighting for self-determination of Mindanao and Sulu from Philippine, he is still cowering in Manila wanting Philippine to claim a predominantly Muslim State of Sabah. His fore-bearers were the root cause of the Sulu problem, ceding Muslim territories to the christian and now he have non. Sultan Azimuddin the 1st who converted to Christianity has killed the sultanate system in Sulu. Non of a Murtard descendants could carry that title therefore all of the contemporary claimants are pretenders to the throne. There is a verse in the Quran that says ” Allah will make a race become obscure and fade into oblivion if HE choose to” That actually happening to the KIRAM, becomes obscure and fade into oblivion. Feel it Kiram. What kind of a ruler who send his kinsman to harm ways while sitting and gloating on his lofty throne. Only people like Saddam Hussien (Armed chair General) did that. KIram please repent.
raissa says
No.
Alaska was an outright, one-time, single purchase by the US from Russia.
See the US Dept of State –
http://web.archive.org/web/20080410122537/http://www.state.gov/r/pa/ho/time/gp/17662.htm
Mel says
Foreign Jihadists to augment the embattled Royals.
If true, Malaysia has got real trouble on its turf. What used to be a safe haven for the MNLFs in the 70s and 80s, may well become a turf war with their former sponsors with a different agenda – property rights of The Sultanate of Sulu.
Jabidah has resurrected, and came back to life where it was once staged for “Oplan Merdeka”. This time right at the very contested soil called Sabah.
Mel says
—
– Above source: Thousands of Tausug sailing to Sabah to aid beleaguered comrades – MNLF exec – By Julie S. Alipala
Inquirer Mindanao. 5:25 pm | Tuesday, March 5th, 2013
– What is Jihadism?
– Who is a Foreign Jihadist?
Victin Luz says
Who is giving in to the interest of the foreigners instead of it’s citizens? How can PNOY negotiate officially when the armed Sultanete groups intruded to sovereign country/parts of Malaysia?
Lidasan wanted us to talk to Malaysia while they were inside a foreign territory ? How can PNOY do that? They want us to go to war with them ? Why? That was the true color of our Muslim Brothers in Sulu archipelago…..they were above the LAW when not properly address or recognized. Walang batas batas sa kanila basta ang kanila ay lupa nila ang Sabah… At gusto na nilang kunin…
Mel says
Apparently many of them still live according to the law of the jungle..
Even among themselves they can not unite as one. Who really is the Sultan of Sulu?
Before they dictate, impose and hold to ransom the country’s foreign relations with its ASEAN neighbor, they must sort out amongst themselves who their official Sultan is.
Otherwise, they all stand to loose everything they so dearly aspire for.
moonie says
we live in the present, not in the past. our ancestors are long gone. we honor them but let us not commit the same mistakes they have done. let us not become extenstion of bloody tradition that had not help them. modern problems need modern solutions. demographics are changing. let us not let our children pay for the sins of the past.
Mel says
Hey Nur Misuari, did you read this?
This comment suits you.
It’s time for you and your battle-scarred MNLF henchmen to give way to rational and intelligent Moros.
It would have been better if you faded away and retired in your nook quietly.
It’s high time for the younger generation or Ahlams and Tausugs, who yearns for peace, prosperity and unity amongst their elders, kin, like-moros and countrymen to live in amity and harness the natural riches of their land and develop the talents of their people.
Sultan Ahlams’ younger generation of descendants has a better chance of negotiating rationally with the PH gov’t and Malaysia.
Hey Nur, you don’t have credibility whatsoever!
Mel says
Erratum
It’s high time for the younger generation
orof Ahlams and Tausugs…Mel says
Erratum, take 2 ($hit)
It’s high time for the younger generation
orof Ahlams and Tausugs…leona says
This is 100% off-topic…why is media showing ‘blacks and whites’ cardinals to be ‘next’ pope? No ‘brown Filipino’? Tagle? 90 millions less 3 millions =87 million Filipino Catholics, practicing or non-practicing, but just the same Catholics!
Isn’t time the pope is a FILIPINO? Yes! 2000+ Years the Roman Catholic Church should now be headed by a one of own. Kami na naman! Always a ‘white one, why not a BROWN ONE?
What’s the good reason the ‘news’ is focused on African blacks? Then again back to ‘White’ either European or what white? Before any ‘black’ brown first!
This is the ‘election’ we should all VOTE [ if only we can] for ONE FILIPINO as Pope!
His Em. Tagle is young, robust and very qualified. No more relic pope at least. One who is already 70s above is too much candle-odor, body odor, already!
What say us?
DaveOfBacolod says
@Leona
First of all where did you get the number 90 million Catholics in the Philippines?? If there are 100 million Filipinos and if you use the previous estimate of religious affiliation in the Philippines there are only 80% professed Roman Catholics, so at the very least 80% of 100 million is = 80 million Catholic Filipinos (practicing or non-practicing).
Second why not Tagle? Well you must consider that the Vatican also plays politics since it is a sovereign state. The Cardinals in effect are MP’s of the Roman Catholic hierarchy and in any government politics are omnipresent in choosing the next leader. Since the Second Vatican Council, there is a conflict between the minority liberal leaning Cardinals (mostly in Latin America) and the majority conservative bloc of Europe, the US, and Africa. One of the prospective Popes hails from Black Africa (Nigeria) and accordingly is staunchly conservative so you must expect that the conservative bloc will vote for him (with the good PR to be earned by electing a black Pope since the middle ages).
Third you have stated the very reason why Tagle will be not nominated or the very most lose heavily if ever nominated, it is his relative age. Tagle has not yet proven himself to the establishment to their satisfaction that he is staunchly conservative and being recently appointed Cardinal he still has to prove his mettle if ever to be considered as a strong candidate to become the next Pope (as what I pointed out above conservatives form the majority bloc). The Cardinals also do not want to elect a young Pope that might become a threat to the conservatism of the Church and they cannot force their mistake out unless he resigns, dies or is murdered.
I hope I have explained or given insight on why politics inside the Roman Catholic Church dampens the eligibility of Cardinal Tagle of being the first Filipino Pope presiding on the Holy Week at St. Peter’s Basilica.
leona says
Just vote [ if we can] for Tagle! If he’s not yet experienced, when? When he’s 70 years old too? What’s he going to do now, keep on looking at the four walls of the church every day until they collapsed? How old was Pietro or Peter when he headed the Church? Do you know also? My guess is: when he was in his 50s as he kept going out to the sea in his boat to go hauling that heavy net to catch fish and push that boat away from the shore!
Do you have any idea why a pope is always more in old age? Because less young cardinals are taken in and these ‘youngsters’ always have to ‘wait’ until they get old to be a candidate for pope.
I am not really sure where I got the ‘number’ of Filipinos. Can you help me how many there are really now? Every minute we increase at the same time decrease but keep increasing at most.
Not electing a young cardinal because he might be a threat is conservatism of the Church is one of the many foolishness of the old cardinals. Peter in his 50s [ if I’m correct] was also a threat [ he was as he denied Christ 3X] but yet he was CHOSEN. Why? Because he was a rock…pietro for leadership. A relic pope always has more risks for disasters and has good reasons to ‘resign’ like what happened now. A young, robust and healthy pope at 50s will resign?
I gave it in a general ideal way only to your questions. Catching you to pump up for exactness is surprising.
But it is possible Cardinal Tagle can be the pope. You don’t believe it is your opinion. I just want to sound off though how I believe it. My opinion too. I believe God is ‘a politician’ too! Do you believe or not? Tell me why HE is not.
Yes, I know all about what you are trying to tell me. I am not yet out of it as of now. Thanks my friend @DaveofBacolod.
leona says
Just one last…I like, and who don’t, to see a young, robust and energetic pope who will last ’til the last rainfall. Not a wrinkled candidate who looks near the grave to be interred!
The Church need fresh and young sunlight not dark clouds ahead or darkness! Old popes causes more divisions and loss of faith of it’s followers. That’s what is happening now.
Thanks again @Dave…
DaveOfBacolod says
Well the RC has always been antagonistic against liberalization and modernization so we must not really be surprised why they choose older and more conservative Cardinals. It is really more of internal Church politic rather than the bodily politic of the entire Catholicism. If the Church followed the will of their constituents, the Church should have modernized or at most liberalized some of its archaic policies.
Even if the matters are of grave importance to the Faith of the billions of faithful, the solemn College of Cardinals is still decided by human beings who are more or less the same with the average laity since they too can be subjected to biases and prejudice. Sure we can be idealists in the sense that the possibility of Tagle being elected is there but the pragmatic and realistic answer is that because of politics within the Church the chance is remote at best.
The Philippines can arguably be the most important Catholic majority country in Asia, with East Timor as the other one, but if you see the general picture Asia will never be a Catholic or even Christian influenced continent in the near or even far future so that the possibility of having Cardinals sympathetic to an Asian Cardinal is remote. As we say in politics, numbers do count and the reality is that numbers tend to skew towards the largely white and secular but traditionally conservative bastion of Catholic Europe.
Regarding the number of Filipinos, I just used the last population estimate circa 2010 and the percentage of ethnicity is more or less accurate.
Don’t worry I am also in favor of younger Popes but the establishment has already cemented their preference of older Popes, maybe a fatigue of John Paul II since he did reign for nearly 30 years. If only the laity can have the voice to elect Cardinals, wishful thinking hehehe
praetorius says
there’s no such thing as “inexperienced” when it comes to Papacy. even an ordinary citizen can be voted, and become the Pope if he accepts.
andrew lim says
CAN WE DO A CROWDSOURCE ON NORBERTO GONZALES?
The former national security adviser/ defense sec of GMA is well connected in Mindanao, hiding out there in the past when the PDSP (Partido Sosyalista ng Pilipinas) was into violent subversive activities in the 80s (?) .
andrew lim says
Ill add another name: Romeo Intengan. These two names could provide a clue why all this is happening in Sabah.
Victin Luz says
@who is Romeo intingan @ Andrew?
andrew lim says
Together with Norberto Gonzales, they co founded the PDSP. They are well versed in Mindanao politics, having lived and hid there many years. Both of them served in GMA’s circle of advisers. They are staunchly anti communist. They had advised GMA how to handle the extreme left.
Intengan is a Jesuit, and a doctor and served the MNLF before as a physician.
Google the rest. They are two creepy guys.
Sam says
@Victin Luz
here is something about Romeo intingan
http://pcij.org/i-report/edsa20/romeo-intengan.html
Peachy says
I found this at ndfp.net
Intengan and Gonzales like to call themselves social-democrats. But in truth they are nothing more than clerico-fascists in the mode of Franco’s Falangists in Spain.
They are hypocrites who love to talk about freedom and democracy but are so intolerant of the views of others, are facile in telling lies and fabricating stories, and have no qualms in getting innocent civilians killed. They are devoid of principles except for their pathological fear and hatred of communism. A simple reading of the program of the so-called Partido Demokratiko Sosyalista ng Pilipinas (PDSP) would reveal their moral bankruptcy which fits perfectly well in the corrupt, cruel and immoral Arroyo regime.
Mafe says
Here’s a “sobering” read from a Malaysian historian who proclaims himself as a “committed Southeast Asian-ist and a committed ASEAN-ist”. It’s interesting.
“We Southeast Asians also happen to be living in the present-day postcolonial world of ASEAN, made up of nation-states that do what nation-states do: Compartmentalize, categorize, delimit and demarcate, fix boundaries and police them.
I have to state here that I am not a big fan of the postcolonial nation-state for the simple reason that in my opinion the post-colonial nation-state is simply the inheritor of the proclivities, bias, myopia and solipsism of the colonial state of the past.
Look around us in Southeast Asia today and what do we see, but postcolonial nation-states that continue to police their people, their borders, their identities and the very epistemology and vocabulary that frames our understanding of ourselves and the Other. Categories like “citizen” and “foreigner” are modern labels that we, Southeast Asians, have inherited from our colonial past along with dubious concepts like racial difference.”
http://www.freemalaysiatoday.com/category/opinion/2013/03/05/between-a-fluid-region-and-a-hard-state/
moonie says
I like http://www.freemalaysiatoday.com. I haven’t made comments there though. nice to know what malaysians are thinking.
Rene-Ipil says
The Tausugs from Sulu and Tawi-Tawi were never subjugated by the Spaniards, Americans and “Filipinos”. And they never considered themselves “Filipinos” before and now. But Tausugs and “Filipinos” are brother Malays.
I mean that “Filipinos” (derived from King Felipe or Philips) are those who were the subjects before of the Spaniards and then the Americans and given independence in 1946. Needless to say, Tausugs were always a free people but only collaborated with the “Filipinos” latter for practical reasons. For centuries they have their homeland consisting of the Sulu Archipelago and Sabah or North Borneo. But the British and Malaysians hijacked Sabah from them since half a century before.
So, it is NOW proper and fitting that we, the “Filipinos”, allow them to secede and determine their own destiny through an independent State. Moreover, we should help them as brother Malays in convincing Malaysia to allow the people of Sabah, if they so wished, to join and become citizens of an independent State together with the Tausugs.
Of course there are non-Malays in Sabah as well as in the Sulu Archipelago, and they should be allowed to remain with their property intact and to participate in governance of the New State. I surmise that the current leadership in the localities are qualified to govern the new political entity after an election under the auspices of UN.
Joe America says
I’ve been following your commentary and pondering things. I don’t think a new state is required as long as both Malaysia and the Philippines progress as democratic states sensitive to human rights and multi-ethnic underpinnings. Then native “Malay” descendants can thrive either place, much as europeans thrive both in Europe and America and many other places. Asians, too, come to think about it, as I look at Vancouver, Canada, and Los Angeles. The ability to “let go” of the bindings of history is important, whilst preserving the lessons and memories. Rather like we ought not try to relive our photo albums. That’s the best way to progress and deal with the cross-cultural mixings of our shrinking, eroding, warming planet.
Victin Luz says
But for centuries our Muslim brothers at Sulu archipelago does not follow the Rule of Law’s when circumstances are going harder and needed most .
Is it not unfair for us who were paying taxes and custom duties regularly while they in that area are not ?
If we are former followers of Father Balweg of the CPLA command ,who were not incorporated to the mainstream of our society nor to the AFP , so we are allowed to join to the New People’s Army and continue fighting the democratic government of the Philippines because it will be the best way to progress and deal with the cross -cultural mixings of our shrinking , eroding , warming planet……?
Malaysia and the Pilippines were both sensitive to HUMAN RIGHTs , but KIRAMs action now going to Sabah armed and many , showing to the whole world that it was only a PICNIC , …now that so many chain reactions happened like displacing the inhabitant thereat , do you think Human Rights was not yet violated SIR ?
Victin Luz says
Have you seen how the Burman of USA and two Filipinos who were Abu Sayaf’s captives from Dos Palmas ,Palawan BEHEADED at SULU ARCHIPELAGO within their TURFs the Kirams and the MNLF ? Did they do something sir? NONE….
It is very easy to say anything when you don’t have an actual experience with the TAUSUG’S …. Few years back , my friend of mine’s wife was BEHEADED while sleeping in a Kumpit with his son who luckily survived the massacre in a congested place of banca’s with passengers also resting , After a long day of purchases of DAING na ISDA with a slightly higher price than their Muslim counterpart who initiated the BEHEADINGs . They escape and went further to Jolo and the crime never reach the court nor the criminals were apprehended to DATE….
Joe America says
Oh, for sure, human rights have been violated and Muslims have been treated poorly and not welcomed into the mainstream. Sometimes they have contributed to the reasons for exclusion (like most people have a severe aversion to kidnappings or losing their heads or bombs in the mall). That was true of Blacks in America only 50 years ago. They did not have to secede to right the wrong.
I believe President Aquino has successfully been the architect of a peace agreement in Mindanao because he understands the solution is economic, and political/cultural, not religious. And is prepared to invest in building a more robust economy in southwest Mindanao.
Give people real opportunity, instead of endless despair, and there is no need for fighting.
I also think one should not be tied to history. One should learn from it, and break free from it.
Victin Luz says
Blacks were different in USA , you made them your slaves and they don’t own USA neither… For centuries you had utilized the black’s for anything and everything and they don’t go on kidnappings and BEHEADINGs Americans .
The TAUSUG’S , everything were given to them by our Government but were not satisfied with your palm, they want hands, your head and everything …. So self determination is the answer Sir.
Victin Luz says
Self Determination is a progress for the Tauasug’s sir.
And a progress for the remaining Filipinos , except to those FEW Elite’s who keep on stirring the problems in Sulu Area.
We don’t need to fight and they don’t need to fight also. Just give them Independence and let those Filipino Bilionaires who for centuries were benefited while the trouble in Mindanao are going on.. Very Few of them who have to sacrifice their wealths….
Joe America says
Well, you undoubtedly know a lot more about it than I do. I only generalize on a couple of principles, not to be bound or biased by history, and the need for a lawful framework for rules to be imposed and criminals brought to justice. The entire Philippines operates strangely to me, with the trade of favors being dominant in hiring, rather than productivity and competence, and setting a cultural oundation for the acceptance of corruptions big and small, soft and hard. The Mindanao peace agreement is a starting point, and what transpries after that is up to the players. I’d simply let the agreement play out, not start amending and adjusting and making exceptions.
Victin Luz says
Yes sir , I agree that peace talk between MILF and the RP was a good star for all of us Filipinos , like the first peace talk between MNLF and the RP where afterwards those who feels not properly recognized formed the MILF.
Now that MILF turns to have that new peace talk ,,, the Sultan of Sulu whose followers and heirs “kuno” belongs to MNLF factions feels not properly consulted or recognized by the new treaty, … They armed themselves ( kalokohan nila ….. They were always armed evrsince ) and proceed to had a PICNIC in Sabah and they were calling us now Filipinos to join with their fight because it was a sovereign fight of the Filipinos ” DAW “, ngee he he …… we pray for the immediate peaceful solution of the problem and if ever manalo sana sila sa giyera nila against Malaysia ,,,pero AFP with PNOY going to small war with Malaysia ” kalokohan na iyan ” Sir.
Self Determination is the best solution for them.
Victin Luz says
They were not LAW ABIDING Filipinos Sir? How is that…
leona says
That’s a very sensitive idea with great repercussions/consequences.
Do you know what would happen to the native Hawaiians if they also get such idea? They were ‘occupied without referendum’ by US Marines and annexed to the USA. They too had their own homeland and a monarchy.
Things, after a long time, cannot just be easily thought of like that. It’s like extracting all one’s good teeth just to replace them with what? You can’t chew ’em all!
Only God can ‘change the face of the earth.’ Amen.
leona says
re @Rene Ipil No. 20.
Joe America says
Hallelujiah, sister. You got that straight.
Victin Luz says
We don’t want another YOGUSLAVIA sir. Genocides everywhere.
leona says
@Victin Luz…’rocking the boat’ may not cause it to immediately sink but ‘drilling holes’ on it will.
I’m sure Malaysia will not commit genocide in this matter. But for sure there will be ‘collateral damage’ as some misguided elements ‘drilled holes’ on the boat.
That’s what going to possibly happen. But I always hope not.
Rene-Ipil says
Leona @20.2
Malaysia has started dropping cluster bombs that could wipe out a whole village right away. The Americans used cluster bombs in Vietnam.
Joe America says
Iraq, too, both wars. They kill people, as do many tools of war. I was trained by the US army to use my bare hands to kill. Not to mention guns, knives, bayonets, grenades and cannons. Also how to withstand torture and sit all night in a hole. When people come into your land with illegal guns and aren’t open to reason, then you tend to want them out real bad. One way or another.
Rene-Ipil says
Leona @20.2
No colonial power ever conquered nor subjugated the Tausugs despite the former’s vast superiority in weapons. Even the Philippine government could not enforce its laws in Tausugs’ territory. In 1911, the Americans developed a handgun specifically for use against the Moros. That was the caliber .45 pistol.
The last time I heard, the Hawaians accepted and embraced tightly their “fate” as citizens of the 50th member of the US of A. In my youth I also heard many kababayans longing to have the Philippines as another State of the US of A – to no avail.
moonie says
the tausugs cannot even conquer themselves. no need to conquer them.
Martial Bonifacio says
Pnoy’s interview yesterday at malacanang
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=FKZRJBUSRZI
@Baycas
nakakasama naman ng loob yung documentary, i didnt know na parang hayop nila ituring ang mga pinoy sa malaysia.
MahalinAngInangBayan says
President Aquino’s insensibility to the plight of our Tausug brothers is really saddening. His acrimonious pronouncements, denouncing the desperate and seemingly last-ditch efforts of the Sultan of Sulu and the Tausug people to reclaim and get back what is rightfully theirs, abet the Malaysians to continuously hold on illegally to Sabah, which belongs to the legitimate owner and lessor, the Sultan of Sulu. The Sultan’s brother and the Tausug men and women went to Sabah not to wage war, but to stay and live peacefully in the land, which, by ancestral rights and by law, they own.
What aggravates the situation is the fact that the President of our country has publicly taken sides with Malaysia, the detestable transgressor; thereby betraying and abandoning his own aggrieved countrymen, the Sultan and the Tausugs. Not only history, but also legal documents bolster the Sultan’s claim over Sabah. If only the Philippine government would hear out the case of the Sultan’s and provide adequate and proper assistance to enable the latter obtain a just and peaceful resolution of the Sabah issue, then all the vitriolic threats from the President, the undue apprehensions and tensions, and the violence that ensued, which was sparked and triggered solely by the formidable Malaysian police and military, could have been avoided, without diminishing President Aquino’s image and stature among the incredulous Filipino people, who are understandably shocked by his callous and arrogant treatment of their fellow Filipinos.
Thanks to the oil and gas, the mineral resources, and the vast, fertile land of Sabah, Malaysia is now a rich, developed, progressive, and powerful country, while the Sultan of Sulu and the Tausugs are powerless and poor and have only the Philippine government to turn to for help in order to get the much-deserved justice that has eluded them over so many, many decades. Yet even their own government has forsaken them, apparently very wary and fearful of antagonizing Malaysia and straining a very flimsy, precarious, and unpredictable relationship, which can never be relied upon as the geopolitical interests and realities undergo incessant developments, shifts, and realignments in our ever changing world.
Mr. President, you cannot defy and defeat the truth even with your firm, deplorable resolve to appease and never displease Malaysia. Your staunch allies are the Filipino people. You should confine and maintain your loyalty to your countrymen and to truth and justice, and not to Malaysia, whose allegiance would never ever lie with you and the Philippines. The ASEAN will remain basically the same should Sabah be returned eventually, by an Act of God, to its rightful owners.
bourne identity says
” The Sultan’s brother and the Tausug men and women went to Sabah not to wage war, but to stay and live peacefully in the land, which, by ancestral rights and by law, they own. ”
We always have a lot of people wanting to stay and live peacefully in our country – but these people brought their passports while this so called Sultan’s brother and his people brought an army with weapons and occupied a village and instilled fear into the local population.
What if Malaysians landed in Phillipines with weapons and refused to response to any of your country’s appeal to either surrender or go back to Malaysia?
Its not rocket science to know that once a visitor carries a weapon, refuses to explain and handover the weapon while threatening everyone – something has to be done.
This so called Sultan’s brother refused..I repeat REFUSED to response in kind to the many appeals and datelines and we lost our men in the process.
So..let this be a gentle warning to Nur Misuari and his MNLF…and anyone else… do not play with fire unless you know how to manage it.
A true leader will think about HIS people and not think about what HE wants!
Now even innnocent filipinos working in Sabah are feeling unwanted simply because a stupid unroyalty dealy behaviour of a so called Sultan’s brotehr and his followers!
jorge bernas says
@ MahalinAngInangBayan,
Bakit Mo Sisihin ang Pangulo NoyNoy? Ang suldado nang sultanate of SULO ay pumunta sa SABAH, Malaysia na mga armado nang ARMAS sa illegal na paraan nang walang pahintulot at PInakiusapan na nang Pangulong Aquino na UMUWI na muna sila para pag usapan ang problema pero hindi nila pinansin at binigyan na sila nang ultimatum nang MALAYSIA na UMUWI na muna pero hindi rin nakinig kaya sila ang dapat sisihin sa nangyari..Ayaw nila makinig sa pakiusap nang Malaysia at ni Pnoy dahil gusto nila ay sila lang ang sundin? Kaya nagkaganito?
Saka mayroon nagpapa GULO na mga PULITIKONG mayroon Pan Sariling Pakinabang at KASAKIMAN….DAHIL SA PERA AT KAPANGYARIHAN….
baycas says
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QgI_282cK-k&feature=youtube_gdata_player
baycas says
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dE_CS5o6htA&feature=youtube_gdata_player
baycas says
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sDiGraRMCxs&feature=youtube_gdata_player
baycas says
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5f_kqdxQEXo&feature=youtube_gdata_player
baycas says
Arroyo pledges to help Sabah claimants
Tuesday, 24 September, 2002, 12:00am
Raissa Robles in Manila
(From SCMP; web page cited next…)
baycas says
http://www.scmp.com/article/392296/arroyo-pledges-help-sabah-claimants
raissa says
Thanks, Baycas.
I FORGOT all about this article.
baycas says
Walang anuman, @raissa.
Ngayon na ba nais ni gloria na tupdin ang kaniyang sumpang tutulungan ang mga kaanak ni Jamalul Kiram III???
raissa says
LOL.
Her gov’t was pitting one Kiram against the other.
Rene-Ipil says
Baycas, Raissa @16.1
NOON, sabi daw ni Gloria na tutulungan niya, sabi ni Gonzales. NGAYON, sabi ni Gonzales hindi niya tinutulungan si Kiram. Baka si Gloria mismo ang tumutulong habang nakakulong.
leona says
Former president GMA should ‘mind’ her pending criminal cases and not this Sabah problem now. Nine (9) long years she hadn’t batted really her eyes to do much on it. She focused only more to get more the money, etc.
This Sabah problem is out of her hands.
baycas says
Norberto “Venable Contract” Gonzales…
gloria macapagal-arroyo…
‘Ika nga ng dalubhasa…
This is the Malaysian point of view prior to the October 2001 ICJ Decision “kicking out” the Philippines from the case at bar then…
http://www.icj-cij.org/docket/files/102/10809.pdf?PHPSESSID=5c19dbe8e80c861d3384398fb1043fca
baycas says
Cold case file: Venable contract
BY MANUEL BUENCAMINO ON NOVEMBER 9, 2010
http://alpha.propinoy.net/2010/11/09/cold-case-file-venable-contract/
Jett Rink says
wow, an old incarcerated lady with a bad neck and back and without cellfone in her spacious detention room can sure plot this whole brouhaha ….
gma blaming is getting old.
must be straw grasping time.
baycas says
@Jett Rink,
Obviously you didn’t get the joke while I got a :lol: from @raissa.
But, point is, Malaysia will just repeat what she said in the ICJ link I supplied in the Know-thy-Enemy comment I gave.
Overcoming Malaysia’s arguments will persuade the Court to side with the Philippines, that is, if this Philippine Sabah claim will get to see the light of day in the ICJ.
I pray and hope, still, that the ICJ will eventually settle the issue.
However, the burnt documents (according to Prof. Harry Roque) which provided us without proof of our claim and the contemporary International Law thinking that self-determination (UN-sanctioned Sabahan referendum in 1963) negates even true historical claims are legal hurdles the Philippines must contend with.
Again, pragmatism versus idealism is pitted against each other.
I believe Tita Cory and former DFA head Raul Manglapus already saw the “equation” before in their decision to drop the Sabah claim. The HOR then realized it too. The Senate then, I believe, was the stumbling block…
Letting the Sabah claim, that the present Constitution allows, remain in the back burner…much the same way as the fate of the constitutionally-provided anti-political dynasty…
Parekoy says
Mga Kababayan,
Matagal ng pinakinabangan ng Malaysia ang Sabah. Noong panahon ang isyu ng Sabah ay laging talo ang mga Sultan ng Sulu at lalo na ang Pilipinas.
Naging mga collateral damage ang Pilipinas at ang Royal Family ng Sulu ng mga British, Kastila at mga Amerikano, pero hindi mababago na ang talagang may-ari ay ang pamily ng Sultan ng Sulu at Pilipinas ang may soverignity ng Sabah.
Noong malakas pa ang militar natin sana nabawi natin ang Sabah, pero dahil humina at sa kurapsyon kahit ang sarili nating security ay hindi natin mapangalagaan at tayo ay laging nakasandal sa mga Kano.
Kung ikaw ang may ari ng Sabah at nirerentahan lang ng $1500 bawat taon, mukhang napakalaking insulto at pagyurak sa dignidad ng mga mayari. Ito yung ala-mafia na bina-braso ka, nasabi pa na nagrerenta pero ang nagdidikta ng kondisyon ang rumerenta at hindi ang tunay na mayari.
Sa tingin ko kahit parang lamok lang na kayang tirisin ang iilang daan na follower ni Kiram, pero ang impact sa usaping Sabah ay talo pa ang ilang toneladang bomba! May ilang namatay na mga Pilipino na ang layunin lang any maipahiwatig ang kanilang naaaping damdamin sa pag-abuso ng Malaysia sa usaping pera at kaukulang respeto sa mayari. Merong namatay na mga Pulis na Malaysiano at sila ay naging bayani ng kanilang bansa, pero ano ang napala ng mga namatay na Pilipino? Sermon at pagkukutya ng sariling gobyerno?
Mali dito si PNoy. Ang karamihan ng Pilipino ay batid na ang mga pang-aabuso ng mga malalakas na bansa sa pag-agaw ng ating mga lupain. Itong China ay parang sanggano na gustong brasuhin ang lahat na mga mahihinang bansa para maangkin ang ating mga lupain at ito namang Malaysia na dati ng nakikinabang sa lupang hindi naman sa kanila ay may balak pa atang palayasin ang mga Pilipino sa Sabah para lang patunayan na sa kanila kuno ang Sabah.
Marami ang spekulasyon na ginamit si Kiram ng ibang Pulitiko dahl sa usaping hatian sa kapangyarihan sa Mindanao, pero sa karamihan na mga mamamayan na Pilipino, eto ay matagal ng dapat napinagusapan ng Pilipinas at Malaysia. Sa modernong panahon ang mga magnanakaw, mangaapi, manglulupig ay madali ng hubaran sa lakas ng teknolohiya at social networking, hindi na maikukubli ang mga abuso.
May mga nagsasabi na wala daw patutunguhan ang usaping Sabah dahil si PNoy pa ang unang magpaparusa sa mayari ng Sabah dahil lang sa conspiracy theory. Pangulo si PNoy ng lahat ng Pilipino pati na yung mga namatay sa Sabah, sana meron din syang katiting na pangunawa na ang mga namatay ay mga bayani rin at hindi terorista! Sila ay mga tunay na Pilipino, mahal ang bayan at ipinaglalaban ang mga karapatan, handang mamatay para lang maibilad ang usaping Sabah.
Sana magkapuwang ang mga buhay ng mga namatay na Pilipino sa Sabah, huwag nating yurakan ang kanilang mga dangal. Sila ay mga tunay na Pilipino na handang mamatay para ipaglaban ang kanilang karapatan.
Tayong mga “armchair soldiers”, tunay ba tayong Pilipino? Pababayaan na lang ba natin ang bagay na ito tulad ng mga bagay na laging ino-operate ng mga propagandista ng mga Pulitiko na ituun ang ating mga atensyon sa mga bagay na walang katuturan para lang mawala na naman ang usapang Sabah?
Ang mga taga Mindanao at lalo na ang mga taga Sulu, ilang daang taon na silang laging api, inapi ng mga dayuhan at inaapi ng sariling gobyerno.
Tayo ay hindi gobyerno, tayo ay mga Pilipino at kapatid ng mga taga Mindanao at mga taga Sulu, tayo ay Pilipino at dapat nating panigan ang mga tunay na mga bayani na handang magbuwis ng buhay para maibalik ang ating lupain at mabigyan ng katarungan ang mga pag-aaabusong ginawa ng mga dayuhan.
Huwag nating ipagkanulo ang ating kapwa Pilipino, tayo ang unang dapat mag-iingay para maibalik ang Sabah sa Pilipinas at ipakita sa Malaysia ang ating saloobin. Ipakita rin natin sa ang ating pagtututol sa China sa pag-aangkin ng ating teritoryo.
Ang tanong, Pinoy ba si PNOY?
baycas says
Oo.
AnuBayan! says
Ang mas magandang tanong, “Tama bang ilagay ng Sultan sa kanyang mga kamay ang batas?”
isellnuts says
@AnuBayan! 15.2
Hindi!
moonie says
hindi, I second the motion. he’s proving not a good ruler. he is leading his own people into oblivion and creating problems with his neighbors. he ought to take a leaf from the english and the way they govern. they have the queen as figurehead. she receives stipend/allowance from the treasury. she sits in the house of lords, is consulted with many matters, but hindi siya nakikisawsaw sa politics and does not rule the country. the prime minister who is elected by the people does the ruling. thailand has the same system. there is king and there is also prime minister. the sultan cannot be absolute ruler, he lacks the knowhow. apparently.
Parekoy says
That s what you call a strategy of desperation!
But still a great strategy. Risk is low (few warriors could die) but reward is great! Ownership and sovereignty are nothing to be brushed off.
Fuck the Americans, they are always looking for their interest. The Sultan is looking for his own interest too and with historical and renter’s payment as part of the evidence.
Do you think Joe give a fuck about the Pilipinos? I understand his concern for his Filipino Family but I think he is more concerned to his ideas being superior than the Filipinos, he seems to like to read his blog as the voice of the Filipinos. He can’t lord this subject matter, he is not a Filipino and this is not his interest. His interest seems to be the held as the de facto superior giver of prescriptions thru his self promotion and a bunch of brown nosing followers like Pacifico and the like minded members of the cult of onanism.
Fuck these hypocrites!
Joe America says
Wow. Got a little anger brewing, I’d say. I’d suggest we talk but I detect you are not in the mood.
Joe America says
Whose interests ought Americans be looking out for if not their own? You mean the Philippines looks out for Malaysia’s interests? That kind of generous thinking?
I give a fuck, and learn a lot by blogging. I’d guess I ve thought more about the Philippines than most, and been slapped down now and then by Filipinos who had the graciousness and courage to confront me face to face about my overbearing manner. And I’ve had many who have thanked me, either within the blog comments or privately, for what they consider positive contributions to the Philippines.
It’s a path we are on. You don’t like mine, no problem. I can’t say I admire yours.
Parekoy says
Joe,
Whenever you convinced yourself that majority of the readers here consider your contributions as gems and bestow you with Filipino hospitality of not offending foreigners, please listen to my applause!
You can always pick the sound of my applause for it is the loudest. You can hear the sound of my one hand clapping!
Parekoy
Alan says
What’s this, a terrific quarrel and I’m not involved? Unfair!
Just kidding. Everyone take a few long deep breaths. If you haven’t gotten over it by then, at least you’ll have saved up enough oxygen for the next round of bellowing.
Joe America says
There is no quarrel. Parekoy is not in my target audience.
Attila says
Joe:
You should apologize for being white and than apologize for being American. You also not suppose to be intellectual caring human. You need to fit in to the stereotype of the user imperialistic Kano. You should have not married a native Filipina because you suppose to be racist also.
Joe America says
Yes, Attila, I need to get my act together and aspire to be a lesser being, you know, set my sights low and learn to grovel before my betters. This blogging and being provocative as a way to get educated is obviously not in line with the subservience that is respected hereabouts by so many.
leona says
@Parekoy…it is the other way around I think. These numerous claimants, had slept so long ago, almost more than a century since or even at their shortest time = 50 Years, they failed for whatever reason or reasons, to pursue in the right and correct way the claim.
Claimants must always be alert to protect, etc. their rights. Sleeping on it is no excuse! They did not have, what we call ‘a Torrens Title’ over Sabah, where such title under our laws is imprescriptible as to ownership. If their claim without such title is recently filed in our courts, having no possession over the territory, no taxes paid for it, no adverse and public claim over it, etc.,etc., these claimants will probably 99.9999% lose in the court. It cannot be solve by the power of the gun! Neither by violence or force by them or by Malaysia.
The claimants have only .0001% not even for a chance. A migraine in everbody’s head! Curing the pain is a capsule of Tylenol or Ponstan painkiller.
Parekoy says
First, we must agree that Sabah belongs to the Sultan of Sulu and its descendants and consequently under the sovereignity of the Philippines, else everything is moot.
Yout logic is a logic of defeatist. You might have not notice but the world has changeg, people now have more information. Citizens of the world know when an abused and wrongs had been and continue to being committed. Even some and maybe more citizens of Malaysia knows that Sabah was not theirs ang the Sultan of Sulo owns Sabah. A lot of them are surprise that their government was and is paying a pittance, a $1,500 rent!
A person or entity does not pay rent to a place they own!
I’m not an apeasser nor a rabblerouser, but a sane rational Pilipino that must not be muzzled to show my support to reclaim Sabah. I don’t need to lick Malaysia’s ass like the brown nosing President of ours!
AnuBayan! says
@parekoy
Kahit na tayo pa ang tunay na may-ari ng sabah, hindi natin ito basta-basta na lang pwedeng i-possess dahil meron ding umaangkin na iba. Sabihin nanatin na nainip na ang sultan sa sobrang bagal ng gobyerno natin na gumawa ng hakbang para mabawi ang Sabah at sobra sobra na ang ginawang pang-iisnab at pambabastos sa kanya. Pero sabi nga ang isang mali hindi naitatama ng isa pang pagkakamali. Marami nang napatay na tao sa Sabah dahil lang sa pagmamatigas ng Sultan. Hindi sana ito nangyari kung pinabalik lang nya ang mga tauhan nya sa pilipinas. Nangako na ang gobyerno na makikipag-usap sa kanya once na umalis ang mga tauhan nya sa Sabah pero hindi sila pinakinggan. Maaaring hindi kontrolado ng sultan kung maibabalik pa ang Sabah sa kanya, pero napigilan sana nya ang pagdanak ng dugo sa Sabah kung nakinig lang sya sa pakiusap ng Pilipinas at malaysia. Ngayon, di na natin alam kung kelan matatapos ang pagdanak ng dugo sa Sabah. Ganito ba ang gusto nating paraan para lang mabawi ang inaangkin nating lupa? Wala na bang ibang paraan na hindi kailangang magbuwis ng buhay?
moonie says
soft kitty, warm kitty, little ball of fur . . . goes the lullaby. leona, they can be rip van winkle again, and sleep for another 50 odd years!
jorge bernas says
@ Parekoy,
Pumunta sila doon sa SABAH na ARMADO sa illegal na paraan? ano sa palagay mo ang kanilang gustong ipahatid sa taga Malaysia? diba AWAY at GULO? Ngayon nagkakaputukan na at marami na ang namatay ay ISISISI nalang kay Pnoy? BAKIT? Ang dapat sana nilang ginawa ay pag-usapan kong ano man ang PROBLEMA? pinakiusapan na sila ni Pnoy na UMUWI? AYAW? binigyan nang Ultimatum nang Malaysian government, Nagmatigas at handang lumaban nang Patayan ang Hamon kaya ganyan ang nangyari? Maraming mga negosasyon ang ginawa at ang mga emisaries ay hindi pinansin kaya nagka GULO dahil ang kanilang gusto ay SILA ang dapat sundin? kaya ganyan nangyari…
DAPAT WALANG SISIHAN, MAGTULUNGAN AT MAKINIG DIN KONG KINAKAILANGAN…PARA SA KAPAYAPAAN…
AnuBayan! says
Kumbaga, tinatanong ng malaysians kung ano ba talaga ang ipinunta nila dun, kung “AWAY ba o GULO”, ang sagot ng mga sultan followers, “AWAY na lang, para walang GULO!” Hehehe. Ganun din.
Parekoy says
With those Tausugs death in combat, it is not farfetch that there will be reprisals.
Malaysia just made a new breed of freedom fighters (terrorists at their point of view). Do you think this will end easily by forced eviction of the Filipinos who were the original settlers of Sabah?
Don’t you think Malaysia is making a new Serbia by deporting those Filipinos, whose fault were being born in Sabah?
I’ll not be surprised if there will be retaliations at the capital of KL if the Jihad Fighters decide to bring the fight into the heart of Malaysia.
Will Malaysia invade Sulu and the Mindanao areas just to save face? Will PNoy welcome them with open arms as partners in getting rid Mindanao of those he labeled as rabblerouser warlords?
What are the parallels in what have been happening in Palestine? Did the Palestinian people driven out by the mighty Israel for its Biblical claim against Palestinian titles of the land? Why is there no peace in Israel. Why there might be no peace in Sabah?
Will the Tausugs and the other Muslim tribes band together to fight a common enemy?
The advantage of Jihadist is that they are ready to die for their cause. Is the Malaysian government going for the kill and complete eradication of Filipinos in Sabah or are they going to be rational that it is time to give recognition and proper respect and treatment of the Royal Sulu Family?
Too much is at stake for Malaysia, too little to lose on the part of the followers of the Royal Family of Sulu. In game theory and strategy, the competitor who has too much to lose has to find the saddle point and be rational in playing the game. The most formidable opponent is the one who has minimal potential to lose.
Now I ask you Filipinos, do you have anything to lose if you want to claim what was once lost? It is a win-win for the Royal Sulu Family and Malaysia knows this!
sykes says
ah…but you’re forgetting something Parekoy…
you only talk of what will the Malaysian government do or what the Tausug jihadist will do.
you failed to take into account that Malaysia has its own breed of jihadist as well. and this particular jihadist breeds suicide bombers.
do you think they won’t come to the aid of their own government?
after all, if this will involve Tausugs then it won’t be a Muslim vs Christian conflict but a Muslim vs Muslim conflict.
sykes says
….but if these Malaysian jihadists start thinking that the Philippine government is also to blame…well…we all know what will happen then
Parekoy says
I don’t forget history.
Before they were called heroes, they were considered as terrrorists!
What I’m stressing is that these same MNLF guys who were funded by Malaysia learned their lessons. They are abandoned by all sides. What are their remaining options? If creating a havoc can advance their cause, then logically they will do so.
If they are going to wreak havoc in Manila too, then it might be to their own disadvantage by diminishing the gains that the Sultan of Sulu received these past few days.
If the Malaysians also send their Jihadist, then it is their choice, but would backfire since they are the bully and even alienate their partner in Malacanang.
The bottom line is this. Kiram made great progress with sacrificing few lives, which previous presidents had not been able to do to gain even a recognition that there really is an issue to begin with.
Read game theory and strategy how it is applied to war and governments and you will appreciate what is happening, and why I applaud that it was a masterstroke having those 200 Tausugs and the crown Prince of Sulu in Sabah.
That act rekindles the fire of the Filipinos tired of being abused by their own government as well as foreign governments.
You may also notice that even the Filipino blogs are being invaded by foreigners proclaiming themselves that they have the best prescriptions to the ills of our country, but the ulterior motive is to subjugate and lord it over the Filipino bloggers by their supposed mastery of the use English language. I was one of the few who was not ensnared byt his trap and becoming one of his pets or should I say being Pavlov’s dog.
Mel says
“The bottom line is this. Kiram made great progress with sacrificing few lives, which previous presidents had not been able to do to gain even a recognition that there really is an issue to begin with.”
With that one liner, I agree and end there.
They got the attention of both governments with loss of lives on both sides. It’s high time to cease the exchange of fire, brimstone err tit-for-tat violence.
Let the surviving Kiram on site submit to the sovereign (Malaysia) ruler’s democratic laws. At first glance or thought – it is hara kiri or a stupid idea. Yet the heirs of Sulu’s Sultanate would make a bigger headway to continue their claims and fight it out in their courts. Epal Patay din lang ang labas, eh di live longer but do it judiciously. Gets mo?
Nandiyan na, make the best out of it by negotiations on different approaches with civility! More on this later, kung papalaranin ng kabihasnan.
Mel says
o dili kaya, kung sapapalaranin ng kalikasan.
Mel says
but it can be averted…
jorge bernas says
@ Mel,
Bakit kailangan sabihin ni Mudjahab chair of MNLF’s islamic Council Commitee na papunta na sa SABAH ang mahigit 10,000 tausug galing Sulo, Basilan, TawiTawi at Zamboanga para tumulong sa mga nag standoff? BAKIT? Hindi niya kailangan sabihin dahil malalagay sila sa alanganin kapag nalaman ito nang Malaysian Forces?
Dagdag GULO na naman ito kong totoo sinasabi ni Mudjahab…Alam na nila na Mali ang ginawa susugod pa???
baycas says
In mlq3’s timeline:
A news item on this will come next to this comment…
baycas says
For easy reading, the entire article is copy-pasted here:
(Emphasis supplied.)
baycas says
http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1370&dat=19890408&id=HqclAAAAIBAJ&sjid=kQsEAAAAIBAJ&pg=2530,1334482
baycas says
More related news items to follow…
baycas says
Manila Standard
April 9, 1989
baycas says
http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=H6clAAAAIBAJ&sjid=kQsEAAAAIBAJ&pg=6515,1513054&dq=kiram+vs+kiram&hl=en
baycas says
Manila Standard
April 18, 1989
baycas says
http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1370&dat=19890418&id=KKclAAAAIBAJ&sjid=kQsEAAAAIBAJ&pg=3446,3090830
Sam says
I found something interesting to read
North Borneo (Sabah) Timeline from 1640 to present.
http://globalnation.inquirer.net/66281/north-borneo-sabah-an-annotated-timeline-1640s-present
raissa says
This is accurate.
Same timeline as mine.
DannyG says
Mahirap kasi sa marami sa atin, tintignan agad na ang Sabah isyu ay usaping giyera at hindi isang bagay na makukuha sa mabuting pag-uusap at diplomasya. Ang pamilyang Kiram, mula pa sa kanilang ninununo hanggang ngayon ay lubos na nakadarama at nakakaranas ng pang-aapi , panlilinlang at kapabayaan mula sa mga kinauukulan, kung kaya hindi na ang mga ito nakatiis, upang hindi na ilabas ang kanilang karahingan at kahilingan sa publiko. Naiwasan sana ang paglubha ng sitwasyon kung ang kasalukuyan at nakaraang mga pamahalaan ay mahusay na pinanghawakan ang krisis na ito. Saan ka naman nakakita na imbes na tulungan ay tinakot pa ang grupo ng Sultan na kakasuhan ang mga ito sa kanilang pagbabalik sa Pilipinas. Marami nang ang sa ngayon ay lumabas na mga suggestions, options, fallback-strategies at “sana ganito, sana-ganyang” mga solusyon at kaparaanan na siyang nakapagpigil sa kasalukuyang kinauwiang stand-off sa Sabah. Kung pakakasuriin, tila wala nang pag-asang masolusyunan pa ang naturang problema peacefully at amicably. Maliban lamang, kung may matino at matalinong personahe sa ating pamahalaan na makakaisip ng tama at nararapat na hakbangin ukol dito. Pero, tila gulong-gulo pa rin ang lahat sa pagtugon sa problema. Wari ang marami sa atin ay umaakto pang mga spokesmen ng pamahalaang Malaysian kung pagbabatayan ang lumalabas na mga statements sa publiko. Bakit hindi gamitin ang third-party mediator, bakit hindi i-appease ang nasaktang damdamin ng mga pamilyang Kiram sa pamamagitan ng pagbibigay na kasiguruan na sila ay bibigyan ng tulong sa kanilang pakikibaka sa mapayapang pamamaraan? At bakit hindi, dahil ba sa masyado na tayong nai-commit ng Malaysian govt. sa iniluto nitong Peace Covenant with MILF sa atin? May kumita na ba ng malaki dito, na hindi na tayo pwedeng makipag-usap sa mga ito sa level ng tamang solusyon sa usaping Sabah? At sana sa pagtugon dito, huwag na huwag kalilimutan na kasali sa usapang ito ang mga tagapagmana ng Sultanate of Sulu!!! At huwag kalilimutan ang ating national pride, ang sovereign power ng ating bansang Pilipinas.
jorge bernas says
@ DannyG,
Kong ang pamilya KIRAM ay nagkaisa at naghalal nang isang sultan para kumatawan sa kanilang gusto sa Malaysia at magkaroon nang MAGANDANG KASUNDUAN ay MATAGAL NANG TAPOS ANG PROBLEMA.
ANG PROBLEMA AY SILANG MAGKAKAMAG-ANAK AY HINDI NAGKAKASUNDO AT HINDI NAGKAKAISA…HINDI SILA NAGBIBIGAYAN…PARA MAKAMTAN ANG MATAGAL NANG DAPAT MAKAMTAN…
leona says
Great Britain during it waning years as a colonial power, created havoc leaving it former colonies to fight among themselves. Like just assigning some nuts to ‘draw lines’ depicting territorial boundaries – India and Pakistan, for one.
Another, deceitfully denying the claim of the Sultanate of Sulu over Sabah, the historical records of the ‘gift’ and ‘lease contract’ entered into, delivered Sabah to the Federation of Malaysia without much ado.
Can Philippines sue Great Britain in the ICJ for this act?
Our present Constitution makes no mention at all about Sabah as belonging to the Philippines or even recognizing the ownership of the Sultan of Sulo over it. Nothing at all.
We had three (3) instances formulating our national Constitution: 1935, 1973 and 1987. Nothing about Sabah. Why? Even granting there is a statute about it but nowwhere is it found in any of the constitutions we had before and at present. Congress never bothered.
Presidents never bothered. The Senate never bothered. So, why bother about it now?
Can Philippines enforce such claim legally? before what court or tribunal? The long absence of a claim filed is against the meritoriousness of such a claim, either by the Sultan of Sulu or by the State of the Philippines. Like the principle of estoppel will apply.
Or the principle of sleeping on rights. Prescription of such action may affect any success of such a claim as a property or territory.
Assuming the ‘referindum’ made by Malaysai was made is invalid or against international law or other principles favorable to the Philippines or the Sultan of Sulu, but what action was made after that referindum? None! Time is overtaken the merits of such claim to the point of ‘silence means YES’ on the part of any other claimant or legitimate owner over the territory.
Whose fault? Philippines and the Sultanate of Sulu.
Certain important events took place way back in 1963s. Today is already YEAR 2013! How many years is that? Fifty Years! Half a century has gone by. Our own laws on property only allows prescriptive periods for 5 years, 10 years, 20 years and 30 years depending on the nature of action or rights asserted to.
Also the doctrine of: in pari delicto…to claim with clean hands. Do we or the Sultan of Sulu have clean hands against Malaysia over Sabah after 50 long years of sleeping over the right? Be prepared to cry over such a claim. The ‘Kingdom’ or throne is long gone!
To just imagine granting such claim will cause so great an upheaval of things that have been grounded, rooted on and instilled in the territory to another owner!
Cry me a baby!
leona says
error: referendum. . . keyboard also made in Tsina!
Mel says
@leona
You hit the nail right on its head! But I won’t go as far as “The ‘Kingdom’ or throne is long gone!”
CPMers, read a bit of history on the complicity of GB arrogating North Borneo (Sabah) unto itself post Philippines’ Independence (1946), asserting sovereignty over colonized and occupied North Borneo, and transferring its sovereignty to the new Federation of Malaysia in 1963.
Additional Read.
http://jovitosalongajournals.blogspot.be/
Rene-Ipil says
Dapat sana ay tulungan ni PNoy ang Sultanate para maihiwalay ang Sabah o State of North Borneo sa Malaysia. Mabigyan ang Sultanate ng kaukulang respeto at dignidad bilang simbolo man lang ng kapangyarihan sa Sabah at Sulu Archipelago. Bigyan din sila ng sapat na yaman at suporta na nababagay sa kanila mula sa kita ng Sabah tulad ng Hari ng Thailand o Reyna ng Britanya.
Being the entity given by the Sultanate of Sulu the sovereignty over Sabah and being the present sovereign of the Sulu Archipelago, the Philippines should endeavor through the UN to convince Malaysia to grant independence to Sabah as a separate State. On the part of the Philippines, it should agree to grant independence to Sulu, Basilan and Tawi-Tawi to form part of an independent State or Nation comprising of Sulu, Tawi-Tawi, Basilan and Sabah. I suggest that the new State be named as North Borneo or Sulu.
I believe that the above scenario would be the win-win solution. For the Philippines it would solve its worst problem of secession and rebellion in the southern Philippines. At the same time it helps our Muslim brothers towards self determination. For Malaysia it would be a face saving gesture and an acceptance of the inevitable truth of relinquishing a territory, which they never owned anyway, and granting the freedom of self determination to the people of Sabah. Of course, the Sultanate of Sulu would be happy as a beneficiary under a ruler who must be determined first by the heirs. But the real beneficiary would be the citizens of the new independent State.
Victin Luz says
The best IDEA sir @RENE….. Palagay iyan talaga ang gusto ng ating mga MUSLIM brothers sa AREA na sinabi mo SIR….self determination…
moonie says
hi, victin, maybe they already have copious self determination, they just dont want us to know. they dont obey our laws, and disregard many of them time and again. they do as they like even invade malaysia at a time of their own choosing. they have done many, many things which people with self determination could not do.
Vibora says
The stand of Former Senator Salonga.
http://www.interaksyon.com/article/56280/lessons-from-the-past–philippine-claim-over-sabah-is-solid—salonga
rico says
i am saddened for our lack of understanding towards the filipinos in the south…we just showed to our filipino muslims that we actually do not care towards their existence, their religion, their heritage, their way of life and their political struggles. The sultanate of Sulu just want to negotiate and TAKE BACK what is theirs. To tell everybody frankly, the northern part of Mindanao and we in the Visayas region, actually exist only to support the bigger Luzon and the elite therein. We are so christianized (catholicized) that we totally forgotten our Malayan/Moro heritage and ideals! Henceforth, the signal is now CRYSTAL CLEAR to me personally and to our brothers in the south this time. That they are indeed no part of the Philippines. Therefore my warning to Christian Filipinos (for your own awareness) especially our ignoramuses in the government, that the SABAH WAR has just begun! Please reset all your mindset to this: The Malaysia Gov with the HELP of our Government, may kill or wipeout 200, 300, 5,000, 50,000, 100,000 Moro (original filipino), but it will achieve NOTHING! Because all muslims (ARMM, MILF etc) in the south are now setting their resolve towards their only goal of their existence which is; to claim back what is theirs. It can be 2yrs, 5yrs, 10, 100, 200, or another century! But I can assure everybody that the journey is going to be bloody and the Muslims does’t really care how long! Mark my word…cause I can see it all coming in place….
To my Muslim brothers in the South: I did not understand your struggle before, but I do now! I’m on your side this time! Mabuhay kayong lahat!
Victin Luz says
@Rico,….Mali ata ang interpretasyon mo sa nangyayari ngayon sa SABAH kaibigan, Papaano mo masabi na the Philippines will be helping Malaysia to wipe out the entire moro ( original Filipino ) …… ? ……. Linawin mo dahil sa aking pananaw ay ever since our Muslim Brothers in that area doesn’t want to follow our LAW’s and until they kept on violating them as if they were not under the sovereignty of the Philipppine Government.
If we go deeper what they reallly want was self determination or independence from the Republic .
Victin Luz says
@Rico ,…. Re-acquiring Sabah as the landed property of the Sultanete of Sulu’s heirs is one thing and we Filipinos support that claim trough legal means but to place the same property and his populace under the sovereign power of the Republic…is a very different thing that encourages war with Malaysia whose sovereignty over Sabah had been established in a referendum by the SABAHANs on 1963.
Basta ang Sabah ay pagmamayari ng Sultan of Sulu heirs pero iyan lupain ng Malaysia Hindi pag aari ng Pilipinas.
Si KIRAM filipino daw sila at kanila ang Sabah ” nobody is contesting it ” , pero ang Sabah ay nasasakupan ng Malaysia and we are not also contesting that facts.
The Iglesia ni Cristo bought a landed property in USA an abandoned small town , so
legally they owned that property but still part of USA and under the sovereign power of USA, it can never transferred under the sovereign power of the Republic of the Philippines.
rico says
i am saddened for our lack of understanding towards the filipinos in the south…we just showed to our filipino muslims that we actually do not care towards their existence, their religion, their heritage, their way of life and their political struggles. The sultanate of Sulu just want to negotiate and TAKE BACK what is theirs. To tell everybody frankly, the northern part of Mindanao and we in the Visayas region, actually exist only to support the bigger Luzon and the elite therein. We are so christianized that we totally forgotten our Moro heritage and ideals! Henceforth, the signal is now CRYSTAL CLEAR to me personally and to our brothers in the south this time. That they are indeed no part of the Philippines. Therefore my warning to Christian Filipinos (for your own awareness) especially our ignoramuses in the government, that the SABAH WAR has just begun! Please reset all your mindset to this: The Malaysia Gov with the HELP of our Government, may kill 200, 300, 5,000, 50,000, 100,000 Moro (original filipino), but it will achieve NOTHING! Because all muslims (ARMM, MILF etc) in the south are now setting their resolve towards their only goal of their existence which is; to claim back what is theirs. It can be 2yrs, 5yrs, 10, 100, 200, or another century! But I can assure everybody that the journey is going to be bloody and the Muslims does’t really care how long! Mark my word…cause I can see it all coming in place….
To my Muslim brothers in the South: I did not understand your struggle before, but I do now! I’m on your side this time! Mabuhay kayong lahat!
And to the ignoramuses in the Philippine Gov: You don’t deserve our votes! Cause you sold us to Malaysia!
Rochie says
it appears to me that it is only the family of Sultan Kiram who are benefited by the lease/rental proceeds from Malaysia- the more reason why the gov’t should drop the claim. besides, gusto ba ng mga Sabahans mapailalim sa ating gobyerno? i have not read nor come across such a movement among the people of Sabah…
Victin Luz says
Are the Kiram’s paying taxes on Sabah rental? Exempted ba sila sa foreign income derive from said rentals?
We can now conclude that MNLF, Sultan Of Jolos men and the Abu Sayaf where doing . They can enter Sabah whenever they like , like when Abu Sayaf snatches tourist at Dos Palmas in a very far place in Puerto Princesa and enter neighboring Sabah at ease , and both groups doesn’t care to implement our LAW’s . HINAHAYAAN LANG NILA ang mga gawaing masama ng mga ABU SAYAF . BAKIT KAYA? Ngayon gusto pa tayong isama sa giyera nila.
Bakit naman tayo sasali pa kanilang gulo. Ipagdasal natin na sana huminto na sila at magkaunawaan na sila iyan ang gagawin nating tulong sa ating mga kapatid na Muslim pero wag na tayong makialam. Hayan kitang kita na natin na sa pagbuo nila ng armado na grupo para mag PICNIC daw sa SABAH ay paglabag sa ating mga batas , aayunan pa ba natin sila?
Kayo dyan sa Visayas o Luzon , pasyal kayo dyan sa mga pag aari nyong lupa sa karatig lugar o probinsya ninyo, bumuo kayo ng armadong kamaganak nyo at mag PICNIC din kayo sa QUIRINO halembawa, ang katapusan KULONG kayo lahat.
Sa lugar nila ang smuggling ay pangkaraniwan lang at halos lahat hindi nahuhuli o Hindi pinapansin ng Awtoridad. Dyan sa Samar subukan nyo din kaya ang magpasok ng kagamitan galling sa ibang bansa,,..huli at kulong kayo pag Hindi nag agad ng buwis.
Ayaw nilang sumunod sa batas natin di ba dapat pabayaan na natin sila at magsarili na sila.
Rochie says
sa issue ng pagsasarili, doubtful ako. these people want the best of both worlds- they want sabah and they want sulu.
with all due respect to our muslim brothers, nasolusyunan na sana ito noon pa kung hindi nada-divert sa ibang mabibigat na problema ang atensyon ng gobyerno (then and now) tulad ng kidnapping, smuggling, private armies na heavily armed and forging ties with international terrorists… they want peace but peace will always be elusive to those who seek war… buong bansa tuloy nakocompromise!
Martial Bonifacio says
Regarding dun sa other groups that will benefit from this. It will be one fo the countries who sell arms for sure or countries who have a dispute with the PH, like china. Kakasabi nga lang sa balita that china will launch surveillance ships to WPS at Scarborough shoal.
Sana naman hindi ma caught off guard ang PCG habang busy sa SABAH issue, baka subukang magtayo ng china ng mga bunker or structure sa panatag shoal.
Martial Bonifacio says
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=q2W_EwZY7MA
Tulad nga ng sabi ni Raissa na parang billiards ang istilo ni Pnoy. He needs more time and this incident caught them off-guard. Ngayon nakatali ang kamay ni Pnoy not only dun sa mga royal sulu army but sa lahat ng pilipino (100m population).
Yung iba nakikita lang nila ito as a Sabah issue but what if this action leads malaysia to declare war? If Malaysia retaliates to our sulu islands?
I hope makita din ni Kiram na dahil sa action nila na ito ay baka lalong humina ang case nila regarding sa Sabah. Sa ngayon parang ang malaysia ang nagpapakita kung sino ang may effective control at authority sa Sabah (law enforcement etc.).
Note:
I posted the punto por punto at 09:35, sabi nung female na spokesperson ay okay sa kanila ang idea na mag sign ng covenant with the malaysian government so that Jamalul Kiram III will be a malaysian citizen so they will be under the protectorate of Malaysia.
Im not a lawyer so what does she imply when she said those statements? Is she telling us na baka ang sulu ay maging part na din ng malaysia?
Victin Luz says
He he let Sulu and Tawi Tawi be part of Malaysia if possible include BASILAN, because at any rate those Island’s populace doesn’t observe our LAW’s .
Mel says
Joe America says
I have developed a new theory that the lunacy of the rationalizations are directly correlated with the depth of economic economic doldrums. Which is economically more robust, Sabah under Malaysia or Sulu under the Philippines?
If the Philippines were had a robust economy going, with lots of middle class and economic opportunity, the Sultan would be considered irresponsible, creating an international incident that is disruptive to the forthright path the Philippines is on. Indeed, he is just a guy with an attitude that Filipinos are getting all stoked up on because they have little else to root for since Pacquiao ended up flat on the canvas. He should be ignored in the Philippines and jailed in Malaysia and let’s get on with things that we can control.
Like, 2013 elections. And getting the Mindanao agreement finalized to provide a legitimate platform for addressing grievances befort they reach the Sultan’s state of bizarre.
Joe America says
Gadzooks, this stupid Chinese typewriter has developed a stutter.
reynz says
Manuel Buencamino has an answer to your question “why has no Philippine President ever succeeded in dropping the Sabah claim?”
“President Aquino is right, the Sabah claim is a hopeless cause. And he is not the first president to see this. Unfortunately, there are still many intelligent Filipinos who believe we have a legitimate claim to Sabah, based on historic title. Consequently, no Philippine president will want to be seen as the one who “lost” Sabah even though we already lost it in the Sabah referendum held 50 years ago”
http://www.interaksyon.com/article/56056/manuel-buencamino–sabah-is-about-self-determination-not-historic-title
raissa says
Thanks. That’s one answer.
Unfortunately THAT referendum was rigged.
Shame on Malaya and Great Britain.
Jm says
Hi Raissa,
I wanna know how that referendum was supposed to have been rigged when the UN was supposed to have been present.
YOu mean to say there was dagdag-bawas at that time? And links if possible for anything that point to anything anomalous on that referendum.
Thanks
raissa says
Patience. I will post about it soon.
IP Code first.
Jm says
Oh wow, I’m new here. just glad to know that you are quite quick to answer to the posts. No problem, patience is my middle name. :) And that IP code is equally important as well, so I’m waiting for your article on that subject.
Keep it up.
manangjuana says
Sad if that referendum was rigged. May habol pa ba ang Pilipinas dito?
leona says
@manangjuana…if I say “IF” there was ‘proof’ of rigging that referendum, where was it ‘presented’? if at all it was. And after 50 years since 1963, we never heard it was presented formally in any official claim, court, ICJ or what tribunal, etc. As of now, it is a lost issue. If claimants file a claim it could be a ‘stale claim’…stale = rotting claim, like spoiled fish.
Santiago Katumbal says
Rigged or not, it has been done (successfully?)…
Brits are worse than Americans… Toink!
Nevertheless, people of Sabah are still grateful that they are with the Federation rather than to be
oppressed, & hackedgoverned by the likes of Lolong… Toink!Jett Rink says
i wonder what buencamino’s opinion will be had this happened during gma’s time? oh im sure he will be on the side of the sultanate of sulu.